Wednesday, December 31, 2008

Your Opinion: Does God Exist?

I have decided to try out something new on this site - one where you (the readers) write your opinions on a posted question and eventually create a friendly discussion.

So how it will be: I post the question, I give my opinions, and then I open the comment section to everyone to give their opinions.

For the first one, I based the question from the comments I’ve received from the 40 Tips for Better Life - 2008 blog post. This question is about God and His existence - this one’s a discussion that can heat up a lot of people, but remember to keep the comments friendly and use good arguments for your view.

Question: Does God Exist? My opinion after the jump.

My answer is Yes.

There are a lot of arguments from different people and different materials, but based on my life’s ups and downs, my faith has grown stronger that God is truly existing.

Many people believe that there still needs to be greater study of whether God exists or not, but at the end of the day it’s still your preference and personal experiences that will define your belief. However, we should always be open to both sides of the argument.


There is no God. You are deluding yourself if you believe there is one.

If things are so complex that they need a creator. Then the creator must be complex too. Who created the creator?

Why did the God of Abraham reveal himself to different people with different ideas about himself resulting in three religions following him and fighting each other to the death. Judaism, Christianity and Islam? God is indeed a fickle fellow.


This question is actually two questions rolled into one.

First, religion is nothing divine, only a matter of spiritual, philosophical, mythological and ethical ramblings that happened to pass on through time, societies and societal change. They never used to stay the same for long until religious leaders (and the political power they represented or counterbalanced) got a hold a writing. Then oral traditions became cannonical holy texts. And a few generations later they indulged themselves with the concept of Divine Message.

Today people still rely on these texts because it gives them a sense of
belonging and understanding which is completely understandable. It is our nature, and life can be rough. What can we hold onto but the idea that as long as we obey the rules, there is a fatherly figure watching for us even in the darkest times?

I do think there is some sort of energy that ties and bind all real, unreal and surreal things and beings together. I like to think that in the beginning, every tribe and civilization has a relationship with the magical and the divine because it is imprinted in us, somehow. This something bigger that we want to relate to is all the visible world around us... but also all the invisible world we see in our dreams and other alternated states of consciousness.

One can call it God(s), or reality. Both are entities/concepts that are eventually ineffable. Religions have all something right about the world and the human psyche, and they all have something wrong. Science can help us benefit natural laws and forces, but it will never directly answer our question towards what is the meaning and purpose of our life, if there are any.

God / Reality.

We gave them names to refer to them and know what we are talking about in a conversation, but in the end it seems that the more we try to explain it, the less we are able to understand it. I think sometimes overthinking might be driving us away from living life and imprison us in a neverending loop of questions bringing only more questions. That's one more point for religious people. They need only to obey and believe. They need not to understand. But it doesn't necessarily makes them more happy, but it does makes them more docile...

It all comes down to one thing. People who believe in God essentially believe in destiny (the Divine Plan). Atheists believe in pure chance. Now, and that is interesting, people who dabble in magick, consciously or not, believe in destiny as a malleable energy : you, and the people who care for you and whom you care about, make your own luck, and whatever it is you're wanting, you'll have to accept the consequences that come out of it.

Pure chance and destiny are two sides of the same coin AND a matter of perception.

So is there a God? I don't know, and I don't care. I know what I believe in, and I believe what I know - until proven wrong!



There is only one arguement for the existance of God that is based soley on analytical evidence and not empirical, 'through the senses' evidence. It's called the Ontological arguement, and it goes like this...

Firstly, here's an example of another analytical statement:

Dogs are mammals
Some dogs eat fish
Therefore some mammals eat fish

This is a logical, analytical statement, where the top two lines are true, meaning the conclusion line must also, logically, be true.

Now we jump to the idea that it is better to exist in reality than in the imagination. Think about it, is £1000 better in the mind or in reality?

A guy called St. Anselm of Caterbury said, amongst many other clever things, that God is 'that than which no greater can be conceived'

So now, keeping this in mind, we go back to our analytical statements

Dogs are mammals
Some dogs eat fish
Therefore some mammals eat fish

It is greater to exist in reality than in the mind.
God is the greatest conceivable being.
Therefore God must exist in reality.

Rene Descartes built on this idea a bit by saying something along the lines of:

'God is a supremely perfect being'

He then pointed out that existence is a predicate of a perfect being, and therefore God must exist to avoid being self-contradictory.

that's a very basic summary of the Ontological Arguement
Sorry it's so stupidly long, but hey, thats philosophy for you.

Shut up Pedro! First of all, get full information and then comment. Hazrat Ibrahim (AS) or Abraham, showed the way of one and only ALLAH, and so did the prophets too. All brought one msg "There is no god but the ALMIGHTY ALLAH and MUHAMMAD (SAWW) is His last prophet". It is the people like you who did not agree then and even now. And so they formed their own false religions!
You talk about who created God, but first answer "who created you?"... "who created this universe?"..."who has put a soul in your body?"..."Can YOU put a soul in any body? Or can any human do so?"..."Can YOU make the sun rise from the opposite direction?" "Does it not mean there is a superior and Almighty Power?" If u can't answer these then don't bother to think about the creator of God!
Allah has created peace, love, sincerity, emotion, harmony, truth, beauty etc. What has man created... Killing, lies, deception, hunger, fraud, poverty, bombs, porn and every evil u can think of is all man-made!

Yes, I believe there is only one God, ALLAH, the almighty and the merciful.

Dee..How many people you see every day who don't have a proper hair-cut? Does this mean there is no barber? How many people in the world suffer from hunger in the world, does it mean there is no food?
The point is, you see all the humans, the trees, the animals, the sun, the moon, the planets, the universe and then u say there is no creator & no God?

There is only one God, that is ALLAH the almighty.

If god did exist, would he send me to hell for not believing in him?

"How many people you see every day who don't have a proper hair-cut? Does this mean there is no barber? How many people in the world suffer from hunger in the world, does it mean there is no food?"

That's a stupid argument. I can walk down the street and ask the guy cutting someones hair if they are a barber. That is physical, tangible proof of a barber. I can look in my fridge and see, touch and smell food.

I can't see, touch, smell or hear God/Allah/Budda/whatever. Doesn't mean it doesn't exists, just means there is no physical or tangible proof.

god is a man made idea. cant we all just be truthful and realize that no one knows if god exists. The only correct belief is agnosticism. anything else is ignorance.

God may exist. God may not exist. Nobody can know for sure. There is no proof either way. Knowing the answer to this question would change nothing. If we were to somehow discover that God did exist, it's not like suddenly he/she would become more directly involved with our lives. We're better off kept guessing. If we knew that God existed, more and more people would only do good for fear of retribution, as opposed to doing good for goodness'sake.

Premise 1: You cannot prove that God exists.

Premise 2: You cannot prove that God does not exist.

Conclusion: Therefore, God may, or may not, exist.

Opinion: All accounts I've come across of God (Books of the Bible, testimonies, personal experiences, etc.) are nonsensical, lacking in logic and can easily be used as evidence of non existence. I am in no way convinced any standard form of God exists. I am open to the possibility of something outside of our reality or knowledge to exist, but don't have any idea what it would be.

god is the greatest fictional character man has ever created. god is the creation of man and not the other way around.

I think a lot of you are missing the point of FAITH. You can't see it and you can't touch it today. If you don't believe in God that is of course you're prerogative, but I do believe in God, Jesus Christ's father. I am a believer and I've made that decision based on my own drawn conclusions from what I've read and heard.

What/which God, may I ask the post author, are you talking about? Which one do you believe in? From the picture I can guess it's the judeo-christian one, but what about all the other gods around the world and history? Do you believe in them also? Or your's is the one and true and only and all the millions of other believers in other gods are deluded? what makes you right and them wrong? I think you believers are all deluded, but it would be interesting to know your opinion.

I believe there is no god. I think humans want to believe that life doesn't just end, that we continue on to some other plane. We as self-aware beings cannot fathom that death is the end. Sadly it is though. I would love to be able to believe in god, but as a logical person, I just cannot.

I have posted a link, its a long one might take time to down load. Initially it may sound like a theory class, but try to go through it till the end. If you are one who meditates, then you might be able to understand this clip even better.

I guess whatever we perceive is just an illusion. In the beginning there was nothing, and even now there is nothing but an illusion.

If god exists, then we're all going to heaven. if we're not he/it wouldn't be God.

For all that do not believe GOD exists, think about the outcome if you are wrong.

I think the fact that the millions of cells in our body are more complex than the NY Subway system, there has got to be a power greater than ourselves and I choose to call that power God.
Then the fact that the earth is "just" far enough from the sun, so that we don't burn or freeze to death. Look at the sunrise and sunsets. Look at the ocean and the world beneath the oceans. Look at the mountains, the seasons. Look at EVERYTHING!
How could there possibly not be a God?

Our present notion of God, no matter what religion, or concept is simply man’s primitive attempt to describe that, which is more than he can comprehend. Does God exist? As a concept, as universe, as a sum total of all that we are, and aspire to be. We are the expression of God thru which he expresses himself. As a wise one stated, “in him we live and move and have our being” what an amazing spiritual concept. And “The kingdom of god is within you” wouldn’t that make the kingdom of God and his kingdom, spiritual not as many now state, an old gray bearded man in a big castle in the sky. The notion of God is a spiritual concept to which, a world of negatives have been ascribed by most of man’s religious concepts. “We tend to ascribe man's emotions to god” bring him down to a material, humanist level. We are spiritual beings having a material experience; seek God in the positive, in the good, in your spiritual existence.

I believe in God. I'll just leave something for all of you to think about. If God doesn't really exists, then nothing will happen to me, but if he exists and you don't believe on him, what will happen to you?...

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."
John 3:16

Someone said that if he don't believe in God, will God going to send him to hell? My answer here is, God is not the one who send people to hell. Satan is the one who wants us to be with him in the judgment day. That's why he do such things to make people think that God really don't exist.

the most intelligent and logical people in this conversation are those who admit that they do not know. how arrogant are we to say "yes God does exist" or "no there is no such thing as god". personally, it doesn't seem plausible to me but then again who am i to decide if billions of other people are right or wrong? what do i know that everyone else doesn't? All i know is that i don't know. nobody does. so don't try to tell me you do, because YOU DON'T. accept that you don't know and live your life as you like. believe what you will and live how you will but understand that you may believe god to exist or not exist but you do not know whether or not he/she/it does. while i may be just as incorrect as anyone else here, i believe agnosticism is the most accurate belief. you cannot and will not prove/disprove god. no matter how long we argue about it, nobody will be able to prove their belief so why is religion such a touchy subject? why do we argue, fight, or even kill each other because of each other's religious beliefs. don't waste your time getting pissed off at someone else for something that can never be settled. i choose to do good for the sake of the world; i certainly think it could use a lot more good and a lot less evil. i don't do it for any god/higher being. i do it to satisfy myself and help others. now i'm just rambling. time for bed.

I used to be religious, given the option of Islam and/or Christianity by my respective parents... but after my teenage years I really started to question if this is what I actually believed or what I WANTED to believe.

My conclusion was that we believe in a God out of a fear of what we cannot explain... and there are so many mysteries to life (and death)! The belief in God answers these questions, making us feel less ignorant (blanketing the problem) and more comfortable with the 'unknown'.

I'm a mathematician by trade and philosopher by nature, and I've found peace through the influence of physicists such as Einstein and the most famous philosopher: Buddha (only through more basic teachings and practice, not the deeper religious aspects). The biggest inspiration is through observing nature's cycles.

I personally believe death is an unavoidable truth as the end to my 'consciousness'. Through conservation of mass, my body will be broken down and spread around the world... and into new life. In that way ONLY will I live on, as I had before I was born, as all of me came from somewhere. And also in that way, we are all connected with everything living. With this understanding and acceptance of the nature of death, I don't have the fear that makes me search for a 'higher meaning'.

On a more political point though, there is no doubt that religion has been used as a manipulative tool.

Lots of interesting comments! Each one intelligent and valid in its own way. I believe in God. I also believe we can't possibly understand more than the tiniest percentage of what God is. I think our grasp on reality is limited in the same way. We have brains made of meat that grew inside of naked monkey bodies. Brains that are not capable of understanding as much as we think they can. Sigh. It's great to try to know, but I don't think it's possible to actually know the whole story about God, the Universe, or much of anything else. So few of us end up even knowing ourselves. It's frustrating, but it's okay. I guess I have the 'old hippie' perspective.

so ive been working on a project of translating the bible into a more modern version.

a confirmed catholic, ive never read the bible.

and sadly, now that i read it, im assuming that no other logical christian has either.

it makes no sense, ive only finished genesis. but the entire book is about how a line of family (adam - cain - noah - abraham - etc) keep a "covenenant" with god and go around fucking whatever they wish(daughters, sisters, mothers, camels) while going on killing/stealing sprees around their area.

Before anyone can answer to the question of GOD's existence, one need to answer this, Who or What is GOD and how do I know GOD exist.
Look around you and in you, what you see or feel is energy. You, the earth, the sun and the entire universe is full of energy. Remember Science! Energy cannot be created nor destroyed; it can only be transform from one form to the other.
Let's do some reverse engineering, we did you came from? Yah your parents, then go backwards, life formed on earth and where did the earth or the sun, the galaxy came from? Yes everything that you can see, feel, taste, smell or sense came from the dark space that we call the universe. Actually there is no creation because nothing can be created, only be transformed. You need brains to transform from one form to the other. That brain or intelligent is GOD.
GOD in his original form is small particle which tends to spin and compress itself. As more GOD particles spin, they form into round/spherical shape and generate magnetic field. Milky galaxies started to form which were gases initially and as the gases heated up and cool down, gases became liquid and then solid, forming planets. That’s why all the galaxies, planets or any other things out in space look round or spherical in shape.
Everything that you can name has life span except dark space. Remember black hole, anything that enters black hole is suck into it and seems to disappear, but actually black hole transform all matter including light back to it's original form, "GOD particle". Of cos since everything is made out of GOD particle, there is no way of proving its existence through machines.
Only way to know GOD is to look inwards, start meditating slowly but surely you will find the answers as you are everybit GOD and GOD is in you. Jesus said those who know me knows my father. Jesus knew he was GOD but not the GOD you and I imagine. GOD is nature and his rule simple, for every action there is equal and opposite reaction, "Karma".

"Premise 1: You cannot prove that God exists.

Premise 2: You cannot prove that God does not exist.

Conclusion: Therefore, God may, or may not, exist."

So god is Schroedinger's cat, but the scale of observation affecting status is on a larger scale, since if only one person opens "the box" and sees or somehow determines he/she/it's real (what sort of tests would you want god to pass so you'd know it was really god?), that's not going to be good enough for the rest of us. So anyway until such time as an awful lot of us see god and recognize god as god, god is, like Schroedinger's cat, 50% real and 50% unreal. So until that time, you just have to be sure you're praying to the right half. Or maybe the left.

If you believe God does not exist? What exactly is it that you don't believe in?

"What exactly is it that you don't believe in?"

I don't believe in God, I don't believe in any supernatural beings whatsoever. I don't believe in spirits, heaven, hell, karma, angels, demons, or souls.

This is what I *do* believe - that the universe is an immensely large, immensely old place, of which we are one tiny speck. But this tiny speck has mastered the trick of beginning to understand the universe. We are surrounded by natural phenomena that is just awesome.

My attitude to the universe is exactly as the Discovery Channel ad campaign puts it. The world is just awesome, boom-de-adah boom-de-adah. :) (Ever notice that nobody in the ad says, "I love the Holy Spirit, I love the supernatural"? Just a thought.)

Why does god only answer prayers that may be just how things were going to turn out? Not one amputee in the entire history of religion has had a limb regrown by goddish intervention. Prayers that are answered can always be put down to some other force - this one problem, that god never does openly and clearly - never replaces, regrows so much as a finger - shows that all religion is a terrible, dreadful way for some people to control/fleece/rule/ruin others. My heart is full of sorrow for those who believe in god, instead of working on their own lives, as best they can. There is only this life - and we all reach the same destination.

i think my experieces and knowledge are not enough to have a clear stand on this matter. but, one thing's for sure- i am already being endowed of the capacity to go through this idea. i believe that there is this binding spirit and in my case i want to call it/him "God the Father"..."God my Father" long as one is truly ecstatic in the beauty of this life, the a god or whatever one wants to address or think of it will surely manifest in one's life.

Since childhood we have been brainwashed by those ahead of us who have been brainwashed by those before them, etc. but to those who believes in god why call him god at all?

is god willing to prevent evil, but not able?
then he is not omniscient.
is he able but not willng?
then he is malevolent.
is he both able ang willing?
then where does evil come from?
if he is niether willing nor able,
why call him god?



i think my experieces and knowledge are not enough to have a clear stand on this matter. but, one thing's for sure- i am already being endowed of the capacity to go through this idea. i believe that there is this binding spirit and in my case i want to call it/him "God the Father"..."God my Father" long as one is truly ecstatic in the beauty of this life, the a god or whatever one wants to address or think of it will surely manifest in one's life.

"Take no thought of who is right or wrong or who is better than. Be not for or against."
-Bruce Lee

Bruce Lee=Omniscient
Therefore... Bruce Lee=God

Argument over...

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